No smoking on golf courses?

[Seamus]

flipflopper

You talkin' to me

[MFAWG]

Cigarettes are different in one, very significant respect.  Cigarette smokers, try as they might and many definitely do, cannot make it so their choice doesn't affect others.  If a non-smoker chooses not to suck down second hand smoke I think his right overrides that of the smoker.

The non-smoker has every right to move, particularly when the venue in question contains (literally) acres of open air free space.

Here's a scenario:

Seamus (not picking on Seamus, he's just handy) sees MFAWG smoking a cigarette 40 yards away. Seamus is perfectly capable of maintaining a 'Safe' distance from the poisons being pumped into the atmosphere.

Another scenario:

MFAWG and Seamus are standing on the tee box. MFAWG does not just fire one up without moving a 'Reasonable' distance, and downwind (and yeah, I pay attention to that, as any reasonably competent golfer should). If Seamus decides to walk over and tell me about the nice rack on the cart girl, that's up Seamus.


It's not complicated.

[Uisce Beatha]

Cigarettes are different in one, very significant respect.  Cigarette smokers, try as they might and many definitely do, cannot make it so their choice doesn't affect others.  If a non-smoker chooses not to suck down second hand smoke I think his right overrides that of the smoker.

The non-smoker has every right to move, particularly when the venue in question contains (literally) acres of open air free space.

Here's a scenario:

Seamus (not picking on Seamus, he's just handy) sees MFAWG smoking a cigarette 40 yards away. Seamus is perfectly capable of maintaining a 'Safe' distance from the poisons being pumped into the atmosphere.

Another scenario:

MFAWG and Seamus are standing on the tee box. MFAWG does not just fire one up without moving a 'Reasonable' distance, and downwind (and yeah, I pay attention to that, as any reasonably competent golfer should). If Seamus decides to walk over and tell me about the nice rack on the cart girl, that's up Seamus.


It's not complicated.

You seem to have missed the second part of my post where I essentially posited the same opinion regarding open spaces.  As both of your scenarios take place in open spaces I'll be glad to repost it for you.

Having said that, prohibiting smoking on a golf course, a walk around the block, in a park, on the open prairie, on the open bow of an ocean vessel and other like places is grade-A ridiculous.

Emphasis added by aforementioned Seamus.

The non-smoker has every right to move, particularly when the venue in question contains (literally) acres of open air free space.

Your use of "particularly" leads me to believe you also think the non-smoker should exercise his right to move any time someone is subjecting him to the excesses of their habit.  Indeed, the smoker's rights take precedence to some degree under any circumstances and particularly if the public place is large?  I might be reading that wrong. 

I think that smoking near the entrance of a public place is not a right you have to the exclusion of my right to walk through the doors without breathing your second-hand smoke.  To be accurate, the word "right" isn't what I want to say.  Somehow I'd like to work the word "consideration" in there instead.

Also not complicated.

[Fuzzy]

Cigarettes are different in one, very significant respect.  Cigarette smokers, try as they might and many definitely do, cannot make it so their choice doesn't affect others.  If a non-smoker chooses not to suck down second hand smoke I think his right overrides that of the smoker.

The non-smoker has every right to move, particularly when the venue in question contains (literally) acres of open air free space.

Here's a scenario:

Seamus (not picking on Seamus, he's just handy) sees MFAWG smoking a cigarette 40 yards away. Seamus is perfectly capable of maintaining a 'Safe' distance from the poisons being pumped into the atmosphere.

Another scenario:

MFAWG and Seamus are standing on the tee box. MFAWG does not just fire one up without moving a 'Reasonable' distance, and downwind (and yeah, I pay attention to that, as any reasonably competent golfer should). If Seamus decides to walk over and tell me about the nice rack on the cart girl, that's up Seamus.


It's not complicated.

Not to pick nits, but UB did admit he thought that banning smoking on golf courses was ridiculous. Grade-A ridiculous in fact, which is a level of ridiculousity rarely reached. Of which I agree. But let me be the devil's advocate for a minute.

Not all smokers are as respectful as you. I just take exception to the smokers argument that if it bothers me I can move. Those acres of open air free space are just as available to smokers.

Full disclosure: On occasion I have been known to enjoy a cigar on the course and have never asked anyone to not smoke/move/etc. due to their smoking of cigarettes. It just doesn't bother me that much on the course.

{EDIT} That's what I get for not hitting the 'post' button before taking a call. Sorry for repetitive opinion.

[MFAWG]

Indeed, the smoker's rights take precedence to some degree under any circumstances and particularly if the public place is large?

To a certain extent: YES, presuming that I'm in an appropriate place.

If it's a designated smoking area, or even an area that's not designated no smoking, guess what: I have a right as a person over 18 to consume a product that is sold legally all over the planet.

Don't like it? Tough *feces*.

I didn't used to be this 'hard line' about, preferring instead to use the rules of common courtesy, but that went out the window a long, long time ago thanks to whiney nanny state types that think they need to protected from everything.

[Uisce Beatha]

Position very clearly stated and understood.  I couldn't possibly disagree more but I'll give you credit for manning up.

Whiney nanny state type?  Why the name calling?  I didn't directly or by implication call you an inconsiderate bastard.  Opinions differ and that's alright.  No need to get personal.   

[spacey]

As something of a libertarian with regards to what people do to and with their bodies, I also take the position that your rights end where mine begin. I cannot possibly disagree more with the idea that "if you don't like my smoking, you're free to stand somewhere else." To me, that's as bad as "if you don't like listening to my music, roll up your window," or "if you don't like me running my weed whacker at 5:00 a.m. live somewhere else."

As an occasional smoker, I feel it's my obligation to do it in a manner that it doesn't bother others. If that means walking 20-30 yards away, I will. If it means not smoking because there's nowhere convenient to go where it won't bother someone, I won't smoke.

While I tend to disagree with them, the reason for public smoking bans in "open areas" is fairly clear to me: not everyone can be trusted to obey the rule of common courtesy. People smoke while standing in line, they smoke in the middle of crowds, they smoke in groups in the middle of public thoroughfares, etc. If everyone could be counted on in every circumstance to not be a *8==>*, there would be no reason to ban smoking in public areas. Unfortunately the *8==>*s seem to have us outnumbered.

[MFAWG]

To a certain extent: YES, presuming that I'm in an appropriate place.


I would think that it goes without saying that

People smoking while standing in line, and smoking in the middle of crowds,

isn't an appropriate place.

However:

they smoke in groups in the middle of public thoroughfares

this may be appropriate, if it's in fact a group of people that are smoking.

Where this comes up most frequently is at Skagit Speedway, where I sit in the designated smoking, drinking and generally obnoxious behavior section.

No, I will NOT stop smoking because YOU decided that this was an appropriate place to bring your children. There 3 sections designated no smoking or drinking, that's where you need to be.

[Seamus]

Seamus has a persecution complex.

In the future please use the name *8==>* Gozinya for all imaginary scenarios.